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Bugs, bugs, bugs > No "*" for WO in NT games?

No "*" for WO in NT games?

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This Post:
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228764.10 in reply to 228764.9
Date: 10/23/2012 7:16:50 PM
Hamburg Albatrosses
II.4
Overall Posts Rated:
83048304
Second Team:
Korean S. Fighters
Still, I don't think it really matters if they forfeit the game intentionallor not. It's just that there is supposedly a rule
that doesn't seem to exist on NT-level. And I've been an U21-Coach and involved in the NT-business far longer (and I was fairly active in the forums) - but I never heard of this issue before. Never heard of a team not getting punished for a forfeit game.

It's kind of sad that BB will just say that it'll correct this bug "in the future" and not right now before the next games are played. If the BBs decide it's a bug, they should correct it immediately (btw: thanks for the quick reply, Marin). I rember some issue regarding NT-games that were recalculated 3 times - so it's possible to correct the mistake right away. And the argument that we're "more vocal" doesn't really count. Of course a country that was wronged is going to protest. Do you expect the english to protest that they avanced in the round-robin? Clearly not. So please be quick to decide if this is a bug (which it clearly is in my opinion) and do something about it. But even if you don't count it as a bug, please make sure to correct this in the future...

Du hast nicht genug Geld, um dieses Gebot abzugeben!
This Post:
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228764.12 in reply to 228764.11
Date: 10/24/2012 5:55:26 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
13691369
Perpete - I´d agree with you, if that was about changing the RULES. But the Rules were there. It´s about changing the application of the rules from "accidentally not" to "yes".

If you break a law, and run into a policeman who punishes you, you rarely get away with "but my friend who did the same yesterday wasn´t punished".

Zwei Dinge sind unendlich, die Dummheit und das All...
This Post:
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228764.13 in reply to 228764.10
Date: 10/24/2012 6:34:28 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
12061206
Never heard of a team not getting punished for a forfeit game.

It's well known that forfeits don't count in NT/U21 games.
Here is one of examples:
http://www.buzzerbeater.com/world/standings.aspx?teamid=1...
Look at Malta, they forfeited all 8 games, however in table we have 4 teams behind them.
And I'm sure it isn't only case.

So everybody could notice that forfeits don't count in NT/U21 games. So we can't punish England because their coach knew it and made good job.

This Post:
11
228764.14 in reply to 228764.13
Date: 10/24/2012 7:20:38 AM
TrenseRI
III.2
Overall Posts Rated:
36003600
Second Team:
ChiLeaders
I agree, it is a loophole, but a well known one, that NT managers are well aware of. To fix it now and change the standings would mean a big change in the game environment that would affect all the decisions made by the NT managers. I stand by my decision; there will be no changes in the standings but you can expect some changes starting next season. Changes that will fix or render the loophole worthless to use.

This Post:
11
228764.15 in reply to 228764.14
Date: 10/24/2012 8:31:02 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
135135
i start my post with the knowledge, that i´m a german user, so maybe i´m biased, but:

in my opinion it´s a real pity, that even the officials here have the opinion, that a highly unsportsmanlike action is even rewarded with a bonus and every user, that has an ethos and doesn´t use a "fact" (again, the rules of the game say a forfeit or walkover is awarded with a *, and to me it wasn´t known before that a walkover is not awarded with a * in national team games and i guess a lot of people didn´t know that till this week, i still think this is just a bug if something isn´t executed like the rules say) which is just unsportsmanlike get punished.

In every sport a behaviour like this would be regarded as an offense to the spirit of the game and would be punished in a real hard way. In my opinion there is no difference between a forfeit here and the same procedure which took place during the olympics in london in the badminton contest. If there isn´t any rule in the bb rules, that a behavior that is highly unsportsmanlike and against the spirit of a sports competition (meaning like the olympic oath) then i suggest to implement something like this as soon as possible.

If a behavior like a forfeit is regarded as a good managment (as B.B.King said in a previous post) then something is totally wrong in this game. I don´t know if both teams played a tie but i guess it´s most likely here, and if it´s the case, then there definetely was a deal before between england and hong kong, that england would forfeit the game (why would hong kong play a tie in a game they simply had to win to reach the next round?). Does this sound to anyone like a good thing? There is a big difference in having a deal to tie a game or to not even play a game.

I understand the opinion to say we can´t change the rules in a season. But this is no change of a rule in midseason. I quote the rules:
"
Standings



"I don't want to shoot my mouth in my foot, but those are games we can win."


The Standings is the go-to page for your current division. Here, you can see the relative rankings of each team in the division. We advise you to check the standings page after every game to keep track of your opponents. Teams that are still in the National Tournament will have a small trophy icon next to their name.

When the 22 league games are concluded, the four top-ranked teams in each conference will make it to the playoff round. The playoff schedule is displayed on the standings page; if the regular season has not finished yet, the playoff schedule is predicted according to the current standings. As the season progresses, certain players will perform magnificently on the court. The standings page keeps a list of the league leaders in average points-per-game, rebounds-per-game, and assists-per-game. Clicking on any player will take you to that player's historical box score statistics, broken down by game and by season totals.

Ties in the standings are broken first by number of forfeits (indicated by a * next to the number of losses a team has), followed by point differential, then points scored.

At the end of a season, a most valuable player (MVP) will be selected from all of the players in the division. The results and summary of this selection process will be accessible for all previous seasons. The overall league leaders and the MVP will be given a trophy on the players page. Using the drop-down menu near the top of the page, you can view the final standings for the current division from previous seasons.".

So the rules say there must be a *for a forfeit, why aren´t the rules executed then? Because a "well known fact" (by the way, how do you know that, because two people said it here?And how should another manager know this fact, when he can read in the rules that a forfeit will result in a * ? ) prevents you from executing your own rules? Sorry, there is no logic in that.

This is just fixing the execution of a rule, which was´nt ex

This Post:
00
228764.16 in reply to 228764.15
Date: 10/24/2012 8:32:21 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
135135
This is just fixing the execution of a rule, which wasn´t executed properly. In my opinion this is a sad sad day for bb.
(And interesting to know for me, that the bb never would have punished the badminton players during the olympics)

This Post:
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228764.17 in reply to 228764.16
Date: 10/24/2012 10:25:02 AM
TrenseRI
III.2
Overall Posts Rated:
36003600
Second Team:
ChiLeaders
A lot of things bother me with your post which I'm not going to get into now because I don't want to repeat myself or get dragged into a long discussion.

While you're entitled to your opinion it is not allowed to voice your dissatisfaction over our policy and/or decisions in a fashion that leads to a long discussion in this manner. The issue has already been decided and explained. We will not change our mind and the decision is final and stands as it is.

This is the bugs forum and I will not allow any more post of the same or similar tone and length, so everyone, please consider this a warning and please read the forum rules (205072.1) before posting any further.

This Post:
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228764.18 in reply to 228764.17
Date: 10/24/2012 11:31:02 AM
white snake
II.1
Overall Posts Rated:
72417241
Second Team:
Black Forest Boars
but you can expect some changes starting next season. Changes that will fix or render the loophole worthless to use.

that's a start. i hope that with the start of next season, this whole matter finds an end. i didn't know that there is no "*" punishment on the U21/NT level. so ist' somewhere my mistake. i thought that it's the same like in the league. would be nice if you BBs could solve this bug and announce it at the end of this season.

This Post:
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228764.19 in reply to 228764.14
Date: 10/24/2012 12:02:12 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
12061206
For me it is obvious. Lex retro non agit.

This Post:
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228764.20 in reply to 228764.15
Date: 10/24/2012 12:16:36 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
12061206
and to me it wasn´t known before that a walkover is not awarded with a * in national team games

We can't punish other managers only because You (or any other manager) don't know how forfeits work in NT/U21 games.
We have better and worse managers in this game. If one NT/U21 manager put some effort to recognize how forfeits work in NT games and other NT/U21 manager didn't, for me first manager is better.
In this game we have many things which aren't described in rules, for example that Patient works like Isolation.
Of course this loophole with forfeits in NT/U21 should be fixed before starting of competitions in next season.

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