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Arena expansion per season - what's nice?

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203675.12 in reply to 203675.3
Date: 12/5/2011 5:38:14 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
959959
i would cut always in 1 and 2, that also might be situational dependent if you reduce it to the economical aspect.

This Post:
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203675.13 in reply to 203675.12
Date: 12/5/2011 7:34:37 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
12061206
Disagree. You changed league level only once in history, after half of the season after You joined to BB. So You have no experience in this thing. Trust me, always is better to win promotion (or survive) to/in higher league than to increase arena. Difference between incomes in higher and lower league are huge and You can always exploit it to increase arena in next 14 weeks in higher league.
So if You lost promotion (or were relegated) only because You increased arena, it's ALWAYS wrong decision.
PS: Increasing arena is only economical aspect so we can't compare it to other aspects.

Last edited by B.B.King at 12/5/2011 7:36:37 AM

This Post:
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203675.14 in reply to 203675.13
Date: 12/5/2011 7:51:35 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
959959
Disagree. You changed league level only once in history, after half of the season after You joined to BB. So You have no experience in this thing. Trust me, always is better to win promotion (or survive) to/in higher league than to increase arena. Difference between incomes in higher and lower league are huge and You can always exploit it to increase arena in next 14 weeks in higher league.
So if You lost promotion (or were relegated) only because You increased arena, it's ALWAYS wrong decision.
PS: Increasing arena is only economical aspect so we can't compare it to other aspects.


but the less seats you have the more valuable is there increase and when you are close to max prices, more attention is nearly worthless.

And i had some experience, as mentor and observer.

Also the first promotion could appear, pretty fast and nearly with a guarantee to bounce back, and demotion isn#t that good to, combined with a pretty much basic arena you mostly suffer from it in the bounch backs eason without gaining the advantage in the first one, when you invest heavily in the team instead of the enviroment to make a more serious try the next season.

Edit: winning titles, and avoiding relegation are main target of the game(in my eyes), so they have a extra value which should be considered too. This extra value the focusing on arena didn#t have, and could be considered as plus of your "always" rules. Thats why i said, on a econic standpoint it is not always right ( i most likely loose money, with a relativ cheap championship roster, so if my arena didn't need work the possible title would be the worse decision ecomic but i would do this "fault" - probadly thats example number too)

Last edited by CrazyEye at 12/5/2011 7:58:02 AM

This Post:
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203675.15 in reply to 203675.14
Date: 12/5/2011 8:20:30 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
12061206
Incomes in higher league are circa about by 50% higher. It's enough to increase arena faster in higher league.
In worst case (if complet is always when prices are maximal) investment reimburses 10 weeks. In regular season we have 11 weeks. But one season more in lower division means less incomes. So if You increase arena and therefore You must play next season in lower division it means that You don't retrieve invested money.

In other cases (if prices aren't maximal) investment reimburses 3+ seasons (because if You increase arena You must decrease prices), then decision to play in lower division, only because money needed to survive/win promotion was used to increase arena, can be called even stupid.

Therefore it's always better to increase arena in higher division. I made this calculations 4 times (between div 5 and 4, 4 and 3, 3 and 2, 1 and 2). In my calculations I used only ticket incomes. But marchendise and TV contract in higher league is higher too, so this money could be used to increase arena as well.

This Post:
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203675.16 in reply to 203675.15
Date: 12/5/2011 8:39:23 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
959959
Incomes in higher league are circa about by 50% higher. It's enough to increase arena faster in higher league.


expenses are also higher, and you need the same succes for it.(and yes first season you have a nice promotion boost)

It's enough to increase arena faster in higher league.


but when you aren't in position, cause of a already small arena you wouldn't see the higher income to increasse it faster.

In worst case (if complet is always when prices are maximal) investment reimburses 10 weeks.

In other cases (if prices aren't maximal) investment reimburses 3+ seasons (because if You increase arena You must decrease prices), only because money needed to survive/win promotion was used to increase arena, can be called even stupid.


your worst case for succes, is exactly the optimum case - and totally unrealistic like your optional case scenario for staying in league. it is by far not optional to charge the maximum amount of money, especially at current high prices are very valuable.

Therefore it's always better to increase arena in higher division.


yeah that better, but often you have to choose betwen one of them. And them you start gaining money earlier, and when you are back at your old level when you finished building you didn#t get handicap through the demotion.

This Post:
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203675.17 in reply to 203675.16
Date: 12/5/2011 9:07:35 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
12061206
expenses are also higher,

No, they aren't. Scauting, personel and seats cost the same in every league.
Maybe salaries should be higher but it isn't neccesary. Please note, that in this way manager gains one extra season in higher division and he can always be relegated in next season (he can even exploit this season to tank). And in these two scenarios number of seasons played in higher division will be the same, but arena will be increased thanks money gained in higher division (so relatively arena will be cheaper).

And them you start gaining money earlier, and when you are back

No, because incomes in lower division are smaller. And therefore You need more weeks to retrieve invested money in lower division, whilst in higher division You can increase arena faster.
You counted only money used to increase arena. You should add money gained thanks playing in higher division. This extra money gained thanks playing in higher division is higher than money gained thanks higher arena in lower division.

Moreover if You lost chance to promotion (or You were relegated) there is no guarantee that You'll win promotion in next season.

Last edited by B.B.King at 12/5/2011 9:09:30 AM

This Post:
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203675.18 in reply to 203675.17
Date: 12/5/2011 9:54:27 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
959959
No, they aren't. Scauting, personel and seats cost the same in every league.
Maybe salaries should be higher but it isn't neccesary.


but at least the salarys are the biggest factor in my expenses, and if you choose betwen investing in promotion or building arena it is more then likely that the salrys rise ;)

Please note, that in this way manager gains one extra season in higher division and he can always be relegated in next season (he can even exploit this season to tank)


if he promotes, and then demotes ... First his incomes ain't so much higher to the top team of the lower division, and when he couldn't use it he will gain much less through the demotion punishment of the fans the season when he have the extra seats, while maybe the other team can make a serious try to sty in the above league already.

No, because incomes in lower division are smaller. And therefore You need more weeks to retrieve invested money in lower division, whilst in higher division You can increase arena faster.
You counted only money used to increase arena. You should add money gained thanks playing in higher division. This extra money gained thanks playing in higher division is higher than money gained thanks higher arena in lower division.


this also depends on your existing arena, if you forget about the few extra cash through tv who maybe matters from 1 to 2. And if you had high prices already, the investment comes back quite fast and can alsu used to increase the future income again.

Also investing in direction of a promotion, always have the risk of failing while, arena income is much easier to plan since fewer things may run wrong. Those risk had to be calculated also in the balance, which econic step would be better at some point, because then you don't even had the higher income.

This Post:
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203675.19 in reply to 203675.18
Date: 12/5/2011 10:20:25 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
12061206
It isn't philosophical issue, it's simple mathematics.
If You increase arena You must invest Your money and wait few season to retrieve it back. If You build arena earlier then You retrive money earlier. But still You must wait few seasons. If You are in higher league one season earlier then You have more money without waiting ;-)
Here is difference.
And You can exploit this money to increase arena very quick. And then You can gain money through larger arena and through playing in higher league.

Also investing in direction of a promotion, always have the risk of failing

And didn't talk about investing in direction of a promotion, I only said what is better. I said "it is better to win promotion", not "to try and to lose" ;-)
Whatever you do always is risk of failing. If You lost chance to promotion when this chance was big, there is risk that 5 times in a row to Your league will be relegated superior team (for example which tanked and now wants to use big piggybank) which will stop Your development (and again - except of top division - and here You have no experience too what happens if great team falls to Your league).

Last edited by B.B.King at 12/5/2011 10:21:19 AM

This Post:
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203675.20 in reply to 203675.19
Date: 12/5/2011 11:06:33 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
959959
And didn't talk about investing in direction of a promotion, I only said what is better.


ok i though:

1) Always it's better to win promotion (or title if You are in top division) than to increase arena


that this means, investing in player with chanches to promote would be better then buildng every time.

But when you have the money already, and don't inbvest it for player and have the chanche to promote with them, why not earning extra arena money during your promotion campaign and already build them?

Last edited by CrazyEye at 12/5/2011 11:08:31 AM

This Post:
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203675.21 in reply to 203675.20
Date: 12/5/2011 11:12:13 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
12061206
But when you have the money already, and don't inbvest it for player and have the chanche to promote with them, why not earning extra arena money during your promotion campaign and already build them?

Then look at rule #3 ;-)

From: Mr. Glass

This Post:
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203675.22 in reply to 203675.11
Date: 12/5/2011 3:22:45 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
137137
well . i want get a buigger arean before i try to go to the nx level. Im winning. and all. but i thinkt he moner money i have nxt season the better players i can buy after some time. I really dont want to maximize my players then have the same amount coming in from seat and games.. Im making very good money per game. i think ican w do more with bigger area. .

i really dnt know alot about player skill to invest in them right but i exp goes a long way..

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