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U21 National Team Debate Thread (thread closed)

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From: A-Dub

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276706.149 in reply to 276706.148
Date: 2/19/2016 3:26:32 AM
Upsyndrome
III.15
Overall Posts Rated:
697697
Second Team:
Upsyndrome II
One last thing...


CAN YOU DIG IT?!

"You will lose." -Ivan Drago
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276706.150 in reply to 276706.148
Date: 2/19/2016 9:50:10 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
102102
Fellow Americans, don't be afraid to step out of your comfort zones and try new ideas or builds. I want to push upon you something new, at least for the U.S., and focus on lots of 1v1f and defense. I want to implement a new style of training into our U21 prospects. Change is necessary.


I have been throwing around the idea of making a "3 and D" build. Especially with the recent announcement of somewhat increased percentages on attempts I think it could be worth trying out.

The basic premise is that JS/JR/OD will all be trained to 14+ before anything else. Achievable with a PAS with a salary around 37k-ish. Along with that I'd train SB [hopefully to at least 10] to counter IS guards.

I doubt a player like that would be considered for the U21 [too much OD, player becomes a black hole, blah blah blah] but hypothetically what would need to happen for a player like to even sniff U21 especially since it is built completely opposite of how NT guards are expected to be built [high HND, high PA and no JR expected]

I feel like inside guards are going to start getting negated due to SB builds. The counter to that is snipers and strong offensive rebounders imho.

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276706.151 in reply to 276706.150
Date: 2/19/2016 10:24:34 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
654654
We actually had a guard like this this season. IMHO the lack of DR/HA/PA really hurt his performance. The only game he did well was when we played a 2-3 Zone. If you want to build a guy that can score, I think you need DR to help you generate shots and you need some type of flow so the guy is not jacking up bad shots and turning the ball over against other teams high OD guards. I think you can punt PA (leave it at like 7-9) if you have high levels of HA but you can't punt HA and PA and expect a guy to be effective on offense IMHO.

Those also aren't the expectations of a NT guard anymore. Unless its a tremendous inside guard, its expected that guards have JR to be able to play outside.

This Post:
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276706.152 in reply to 276706.151
Date: 2/19/2016 11:09:28 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
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GOLDMEMBEAR

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276706.153 in reply to 276706.151
Date: 2/19/2016 11:14:26 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
102102
I completely agree with DRV, the issue is there is no way to train it individually and HND eats up CAP.

You had a guard with high SB on the team this season? Or just the high JS/JR component?

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276706.154 in reply to 276706.153
Date: 2/19/2016 11:25:42 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
654654
shooter with OD and no HA/DR/PA. no sb

From: oriolekid

To: Phyr
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276706.155 in reply to 276706.154
Date: 2/19/2016 12:41:02 PM
LionPride
II.3
Overall Posts Rated:
246246
How'd he do? That's my least favorite build on a U21 guard. Driving is everything, and passing makes his driving more effective, assuming BB follows real life basketball(not always a given).

From: FurY

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276706.156 in reply to 276706.155
Date: 2/19/2016 2:17:21 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
109109
I don't like that much either. Driving improves a player's ability to provide push in a situation where he is stuck, PA makes it easier for the flow not to get interrupted.

I don't mind the high IS/DR builds, but i tend to be a little weary of the interest of all positions reaching the same height (somewhere close to 16-17 DR and 16-17 IS), as i've seen other teams more successful with more unique players.

What consistently seems to work well even in a Look inside or Low Post offense is having that ball movement guy hold down the PG spot. This would be inconsistent with A-dub's build in some ways, because it would require less focus on DR (still around 13-14) in order to get more maximization out of OD and PA. Ideally that build gets some free SB to (speaking to the 6-7 starting point), but i think that the focus beyond that is a bit wasted in terms of development time unless you are building a SF (in which ID and SB become more interesting).

Last edited by FurY at 2/19/2016 2:17:33 PM

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276706.157 in reply to 276706.155
Date: 2/19/2016 3:26:02 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
102102
I doubt he did well, especially since we play inside focus a majority of the time.

My point, which hasn't been considered [one of the issues I've had with offsiter often] is that the sim is changing. Shouldn't we try to maximize on those changes? Or at least consider it.

Yes, te player last season may have not played well, but that was before the change. How much will this change effect the game? I have no idea, but shouldn't we take a proactive approach instead of just doing the same things we did prior and failed at?

This Post:
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276706.158 in reply to 276706.157
Date: 2/19/2016 7:05:49 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
5353
hypothetical question for all potential managers,
Two players look like this at start of u21 year, whats your action, if any.

Player A
7/12/12/3/4/10/8/10/10/12

Player B
8/8/9/6/6/10/10/10/10/12

This Post:
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276706.159 in reply to 276706.157
Date: 2/19/2016 7:07:44 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
109109
The three point changes, should they be significant, will not be seen for the next two seasons, maybe three. Guys that are 20-21 likely wouldn't be molded to that perimeter style of play. For the SB change, I think that was more of a personal call from phyr. He still used one or two bigs with SB and guards with decent SB.... But I get the sense that he wasn't that keen on it. Perhaps owners of players didn't want in as well.

Finally, the offsite isn't one big family, it's several small groups of people working towards different priorities. It hasn't been at a cabal level since old man Jfarb01 retired

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