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(how) Do the box +1 defences work?

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This Post:
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288522.15 in reply to 288522.14
Date: 7/21/2017 11:17:00 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
14901490
Still in the cup for now, but I will definitely be able to at the end of the season. It's not hard to guess that the guy with 47 is (31801722) and that I will kind of need him to play in the league unless I go into tanking mode. So it will be at the end of the season. I might even get supporter towards the end and arrange a scrimmage between my 2 teams (I usually use come playoffs time in order to adjust minutes as I like, but I can also use it for this).


From: _wella_
This Post:
11
288522.16 in reply to 288522.4
Date: 7/21/2017 4:43:31 PM
Vattjom Vatos
SBBL
Overall Posts Rated:
258258
Second Team:
Utopia Vatos
Box-and-One defenses: Four players play in a zone defense protecting the basket while the fifth player plays a man-to-man defense guarding the best offensive player on the other team. This prevents him from scoring as much. There are two types of box-and-one defenses:
Inside Box-and-One: The fifth defender focuses on the opponent's best inside scorer. Normal pace.
Outside Box-and-One: The fifth defender focuses on the opponent's best outside scorer. Normal pace.


Could it be, that the "fifth defender" in Inside Box-and-One is the C and the "fifth defender" in Outside Box-and-One is the PG?
It could also (not likely!) mean that the PG (the others positions are selected to the four man inside box) defends the best scorer, both in Inside Box-and-One and Outside Box-and-One, since the PG(or rather the position) is the fifth defender(position wise) when calculating the zone?

It's not a crystal clear explanation in the manual!

I sincerely thought the Outside Box-and-One one was a four-player outside zone and the C, i was thinking "Outside box" + "and one" to begin with. :-) No wonder it didn't work the way I thought it would! ;-)

But when I read the rules again (and again) I assume, that in ANY of the Box-and-One defenses you need both OD and ID (and SB and RB[more in Outside Box-and-One] as well) since the four man zone will defend against both outside AND inside players and grab rebounds!

This Post:
00
288522.17 in reply to 288522.16
Date: 7/21/2017 6:48:24 PM
Greensboro Generals
IV.9
Overall Posts Rated:
746746
Perhaps the best way to get the matchups desired is to blank the assignments. I also think it is a gimmick defense that in terms of being used for an entire game is only effective against someone who is a one trick pony.


A great example of this is very early in Dean Smith's career Carolina went to Kentucky and the Cats had a great scorer named Cotton Nash and the Heels ran a box in one on that guy and by games end he was resigned to just sitting in the corner watching the other players basically playing 4 on 4 as Dean pulled off his first great upset.

This Post:
00
288522.18 in reply to 288522.17
Date: 7/22/2017 11:47:00 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
14901490
It doesn't work like that in this game. If you blank the defensive assignments the game will determine that for you, but once it's decided it sticks. If the other team is playing patient the GE won't assign your best defender to guard the best scorer, but it will assign him to guard the position where he defends best (so it's unlikely it will select a guard to defend a forward...)

This Post:
00
288522.19 in reply to 288522.18
Date: 7/22/2017 7:37:22 PM
Greensboro Generals
IV.9
Overall Posts Rated:
746746
Again, a gimmick D. Sounds like either way it is a bit of a crap shoot as to if the right guy will go Claudio Gentile on the best scorer Plus if your opponent decides to Jan you up by going patient and stacking his best shooter at C then your boned.

This Post:
00
288522.20 in reply to 288522.19
Date: 7/22/2017 7:54:04 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
14901490
It happens also with other offenses. One guy often takes a lot of shots and you need to guess where the guy is going to play. Emptying the defensive assignments will not help you putting your best defender on the best offensive player (irrespective of where he plays) as far as I know.

I used patient as an example, because the issue is magnified there.

Last edited by Lemonshine at 7/22/2017 7:54:29 PM

This Post:
88
288522.21 in reply to 288522.20
Date: 7/23/2017 11:31:48 AM
white snake
II.1
Overall Posts Rated:
73097309
Second Team:
Black Forest Boars
I took a look at my Box+1 thread in my federation. At the beginning of 2015 I ran an analysis on the two Boxes. If you can wait and are interessted, I will post an english summary of the results during the next week.

This Post:
00
288522.23 in reply to 288522.21
Date: 7/24/2017 5:55:12 AM
Arsenal 98
II.3
Overall Posts Rated:
282282
Second Team:
Stamford Snow Leopards
Yep, sounds good :)

I'm off work today so I'm gonna have a look at some old games of my own where I've played it before. I should have close enough data and/or memory of players attributes for it to be worth something (to be anyway).

This Post:
00
288522.25 in reply to 288522.17
Date: 7/26/2017 12:29:29 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
120120
Perhaps the best way to get the matchups desired is to blank the assignments. I also think it is a gimmick defense that in terms of being used for an entire game is only effective against someone who is a one trick pony.



All the success I ever had with Box + 1 defenses is when I ran a team that was 5 starters and 2 bench guys deep basically of all similarly built players who all had 8-10 OD 8-11 ID and 5-8 SB.

All 5 could play defense interchangeably with each other. But I was forced to that end by subjecting myself to a 100% only players I draft and train team.

Last edited by RandyMoss at 7/26/2017 12:30:36 AM

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