BuzzerBeater Forums

Suggestions > Moratorium on ALL new changes for one year

Moratorium on ALL new changes for one year

Set priority
Show messages by
This Post:
00
182276.26 in reply to 182276.20
Date: 4/22/2011 11:12:51 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
192192
It's four BB seasons. A long time, but it's still 25% of the time in which BBs may already implement change.

A year is an arbitrary time period, I admit, but even if it's two or three seasons, the sentiment remains the same.

This Post:
11
182276.27 in reply to 182276.21
Date: 4/22/2011 11:14:58 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
192192
Personally your lack of any reasoning for your opinions is what bothers me, with the harshness of your tone a distant second. Your last sentence indicates that you still haven't read the first post.

This Post:
22
182276.28 in reply to 182276.26
Date: 4/22/2011 11:42:00 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
32293229
It's four BB seasons. A long time, but it's still 25% of the time in which BBs may already implement change.

A year is an arbitrary time period, I admit, but even if it's two or three seasons, the sentiment remains the same.


I don't know that a blanket moratorium is the right answer either. I think that if there's a real problem, a change is needed, and if there is not, no change is needed. For example, all this 2-3 talk, they looked over it and said essentially that it's working as it's intended to and that people aren't using the right type of players to make it be the effective defense it could be. That seems perfectly reasonable. If, on the other hand, they had seen that, for example, they had failed to balance it properly (e.g., not counting the guards' OD skill when considering the opponent driving, making offense way too successful), then they should definitely make a change.

Essentially, and I mean this in as positive manner as possible, not only should they not make changes because people are complaining, but they should also not refrain from making changes because people are complaining about change.

This Post:
00
182276.29 in reply to 182276.28
Date: 4/22/2011 12:40:54 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
192192
Very good point. I'd say that BBs need not refrain from making changes, but a moratorium lets both sides go about it more reasonably.

The BBs generally do a very good job, but making changes such as this season's in every offseason would be a dangerous path to go down. The point is that the severity of a change needs to be understood by both BBs and managers, so the process should be more rigorous than complaint/response. And when a change is implemented, the BBs should be so sure it's right that they can't stand to think about it anymore.

Same principle behind, for example, the arduous process required to amend the US Constitution.

Last edited by RiseandFire at 4/22/2011 12:41:57 PM

This Post:
00
182276.30 in reply to 182276.25
Date: 4/22/2011 6:12:30 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
217217
1 - help defense has nothing to do with od in this game - bb's have directly said that help defense is controlled by sb

2- NT managers have motives yes , and yes its cause they want a behemoth , now shouldnt we be able to make a pure defensive shot blocking behemoth thats effective at stopping these players ? no we cant because sb is crazy expensive and ultimately flawed.

3- your thoughts on this is flawed as well , there are what 50k , 60k uses in this game ? and no one has a team that can run a 2-3 effectively ? think of it along those lines , 2-3 is broken its that simple , it may indeed work how they intended it to work but if so the bb's view on how a 2-3 should work and what type of players are needed is ultimately flawed.

dont get me wrong i think the bb's do a great job with almost everything in this game , its just too risky for any team to give 2-3 a go , to try an build a team that can run a 2-3 bb's have hinted the shot blocking is the key , yet to train shotblocking you need to give up something , so you have to ask what you can give up that will not cripple your player ?
from my point of view and id guess many others theres nothing you can give up for it , without giving up to much.

This Post:
00
182276.31 in reply to 182276.1
Date: 4/22/2011 6:21:55 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
14651465
You constantly complain that I haven,t read the first post which is incorrect but just to show that I have I will respond in detail.

There was once an American football MMORPG called Goal Line Blitz. It had inherent flaws, but it was still reasonably fun - until managers started complaining about the game every time something went wrong for their team. This allowed them to blame their troubles on the game, instead of taking responsibility and working to succeed within the current game.


I think I played it too briefly but I don't like any game where the more you spend the more advantages you get. I think this was the game but I admit I am not 100% on this. This reaction is natural and typical for players and BB naturally has that issue too.

Admins listened to too many of these complaints and changed the game rapidly, causing new problems every season, and the game is now a ghost town, where even the most dedicated managers only play because they bought too many "flex points" and don't want to waste their money.


You like to talk about how my points are opinions not facts. This statement by you is an opinion. You have no proof. Have you conducted a survey of 5,000 ex-players and discovered why they quit? You are merely speculating and then attempting to transfer your speculation into proof for your argument about BB. Maybe it wasn't a good game. Maybe people didn't like the pricing policy. Maybe it looked good but lacked depth (the Grid Iron game I tried seemed like that).

I love BB because it's avoided going down this path. However, I've been troubled by some of what I've heard around the BB forums. The salary floor, for example, was implemented as a response to complaints about tanking teams - a noble cause, surely - but it ignored the plight of teams promoting into leagues they can't compete in anyways.


So you think when the NBA has an expansion and teams can't compete in their first season they would be allowed to have 3 rookies that they are training and 2 lucky fans playing each game? The salary floor is still really really low but it does make the game a bit more sensible and has been widely praised as it has no effect on 95% of teams but stops those wrecking the game for others.

The 2-3 zone is said by many managers to be "broken," even though there has been little to no use of the defense with forwards with OD and a center with SB. If 2-3 is changed because of the complaints of managers who are just upset they lost games when they tried playing it with a 4 OD PF, that might be it for me.


I hear all these arguments all the time from you and others saying the 2/3 zone is fine you just need a team of players with 14 OD, 14 ID and 14 SB to make it work. What? If you had such extreme players and I doubt there are many in the entirity of BB with that combination then you could make any defence work. Players do not complain because they lost, they are complaining because it is not doing what it is supposed to do, defend the basket against inside shots and provide help defence against inside players. There are about 4-5 threads running at the moment on the 2/3 zone so I wont rehash all the evidence here. There are 60,000 players, how can you possibly say there has been been"little to no use of the defense with forwards with OD and a center with SB"? If the top teams in the top leagues in the world Spain, USA, National Teams can't make it work what sort of level players do you need?

Changes should not be reactionary.


Why? If my car broke down every week I would change something and get it fixed or buy a new car.

From: yodabig

This Post:
33
182276.32 in reply to 182276.31
Date: 4/22/2011 6:29:31 PM
Overall Posts Rated:
14651465
I ran out of characters so continue here.

I think the BBs generally do a great job of this, but seeing that this offseason contained quite a few changes, I think it would be wise to halt any non-cosmetic changes for a calendar year. The strategy of over-tinkering with the game engine, financial system, etc. will only result in another GLB, a dying hulk of something once great, but destroyed from within.


One year of no changes would be the surest way of killing the game but that I admit is only my opinion. However the game playing public play games for fun and excitement. How is a game that leaves bugs unfixed and doesn't have any new features for a year going to keep it's players happy.

How about some positive praise for all the fantastic changes the BBs have made over the last year.
Delete multiple BB mails.
See the nations and if it is a new flag on the scrimmage page.
Salary floor.
Much beter draft system.
No wages in offseason for teams not playing.
Reduced salaries of the top players.
Injuries go away over the offseason.
Position played listed in players game history.
Fixed the BBB.


I am sure there are dozens of other positive changes but these are just a few of the things the BBs have done to make our wonderful game even better.

From: CrazyEye

This Post:
00
182276.33 in reply to 182276.30
Date: 4/23/2011 3:12:23 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
959959
i had succes playing 2-3 -> not broken ;)

From: zyler

This Post:
00
182276.34 in reply to 182276.33
Date: 4/23/2011 3:14:00 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
217217
before or after game engine changes ?

a few games of proof please ?

and what skills made 2-3 effective ?

From: CrazyEye

This Post:
00
182276.35 in reply to 182276.34
Date: 4/23/2011 3:39:43 AM
Overall Posts Rated:
959959
before, no after ... What do you think ;)

I made those examples also more often here, and i don't know your roster and can not say what the different.

(26297901) - not mine team, but a weaker team which played me away and was winning till his PG was injured and his SF fouled out.

(26297795) - my opponent had a really good roster, and his offense not really work ;)

(29598029) - lower effort, strong opponent, right tactic

(26297894) i win but it was a game betwen number 2 and 16 in the table, and a 6 men rotation isn't also a good choiche especially against an inside team.

Yes this examples are a bit older, but i don't use it that often because you should to be sure your opponent played it, and this examples was from an old post which i could find quite easily.

Advertisement