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One of our d.1 team tried it but he didnt success. Then he sold them.

I didn't read through all of the posts, so maybe I'll say something redundant, but here it is anyway:

I posted a very similar idea several months ago, maybe half a year, on General BB (English). The post contains the hardest part: execution. I don'tfear anyone would copy this idea, because 99.9% of users on BB follow the easy path, which is LI-M2M to oblivion and don't want to risk something to try anything new.

Anyway, your idea would take too much time. First, you train two players. But when you finish the next two players, first two are already too old and they can't play together. The solution: you have to finish first two players with 2-position training which benefits the second "batch" of players, which is 1 on 1 for forwards.

My model/theory trains four players, but you have to buy the 5th one. If you are lucky and you get really nice rookies, you can train all five, but they won't be able to play more than two seasons together before two oldest ones start to drop in skills.
The idea is very simple: take skills from guards that make them expensive, in this case some PA and some JR, and convert them into IS. Same applies to inside players: take IS out and convert it into PA. Of course you have to switch the whole team on defense.
Those are the skills, of course I'm talking about offense only:

PG and SG:

6, 6
6, 16
16, 16
8, 18
18, 12

Inside players (they can play SF, PF or C):

18, 12
18, 18
18, 12
18, 6
6, 6

How it's done:

Buy two short players (190 - 193 cm is ideal). Train them like normal guards, but spend 3-4 weeks per season on IS for C. Don't train HA and DR above 14.

When their JS, OD, JR, PA and IS are on desired level, buy two tall players (at least 208 cm, the higher the better). Train those two with two guards in 1 on 1 for forwards, until guards reach desired HA and DR. Then train them in ID and RB until desired levels. Spend at least 3 weeks per season on PA.

When ID, RB and PA reach desirable levels, you can buy two rookie guards and train all four in 1 on 1 for forwards. I'm sure you see a pattern here...

Such a team can play 2-3 seasons together, but since players cycle, you get to finish two new guards when the old ones retire.

Notice that each time you train one-position either guards on inside players, there are only two of them. If you want, you can add a third player that can start with guards and finish with bigs, but you have be careful about order in which you train the skills. You can use that player as a SF on defense, or just buy one on the market.

I started the sequence with Anžic. Navršnik is too old to participate in the model, but Anžic will be one of the two guards. Gokturk will be the other. Anžic and Gokturk are too far apart though, so maybe I'll buy another player like Gokturk in a season or two. Notice though you can buy 19- or 20-y old players, that are traditional guards with IS 7-8 and add them to IS training of your previous guard.

Last edited by Koperboy at 2/9/2013 5:05:06 PM

Thanks for your reply, and the training schedule you have seems workable indeed. But how do you think your team would perform? I guess you basically have a LI team but with with incapable bigs on offense that rebound and pass the ball back to the guards, or how do you see it?

Bigs are playing pg and sg on offense...this team can play li, patient or outside iso. Not sure for motion yet.

What I meant is that your "Bigs" look like LI guards; they got all guard skills and just some lesser JR (not a biggie for LI) and not high passing but they can be SG's, and they got high IS but that's for LI. Then you got bigs that don't have IS and have passing instead, so they just rebound, don't shoot but pass the ball. So although you're saving some money, you lose your inside presence too.

Well, I didn't say you can train 4-5 guys, each up to at least 130 skillpoints, and play any tactic you want with them. You just can't. You are limited with time - there's only so much training seasons in a player. You can't train them up to 30 years. Also you can't have a team that can win with any tactic you want. Your team has to be specialized in 2-3 tactics and be effective in executing them. You can't have a team that can play R&G and LI equally good.

I'm training Anžic, who is 201 cm (preferred height for your trainees), for five seasons now and it's not easy. With proper training management, you can train three guys at once, but that would take 7 seasons. After you're done with those three, you spend next 7 seasons training at least two new guys. Then you can play those five together when first three guys are 32...nope, it doesn't work.

So considering time limit, that's the best I could come up with. Yes, those guards are looking like popular LI guards; but those LI guards don't have JS, DR and IS 18 or more which my guys would have. Plus, they would play on SF, PF or C position. Now imagine two of those guards playing SF and PF, a generic SF on center and your two passing bigs on PG and SG. You play Motion. I bet you'd get some really interesting stuff out of your team, like your PG, SG and C passing and driving, and your SF and PF taking jumpers and 3s. Or playing Outside Isolation with same lineup.

Goal of my idea is to bypass the toughest obstacles (namely OD on PG and SG) and to attack the opponent's weaknesses, that's OD on SF, PF and C. Everyone plays LI lately, so their SFs don't have more than 14-15 OD and their PFs don't have more than 10 OD. Their PGs and SGs have OD=20, but with your passing bigs, you really don't care about that, do you? Now take your players and play Motion or R&Gagainst PG and SG with OD=20...

The idea is to "force" game engine to always choose your guards and SF as scorers, whatever position they may play.

Yeah my example roster wasn't a realistic one, just one to show how many skillpoints you can get for a certain amount of salary. But I think that if you switch OD and ID instead of IS for PA and JR/PA for IS, you don't have to compromise your offense and still save a lot of salary. I haven't taken the time to work out an entire training schedule to be completed by one team, but I'll try it soon to compare to yours.

I do think your plan is good and certainly has its benefits, and maybe more realistic than what I'm aiming for. I'm very curious to hear how it works, so please let me know when you get the chance to test it.

The chance to test...what exactly? How do games look? It's a long way to go to obtain those players... at least 8-9 seasons from now. I've been also thinking to buy 20-21y old centers with good ID and RB, and just train them in 1 on 1 and Passing. That would speed things up a bit. At least two guards would be able to play with two bigs for longer period of time.

Yeah I understand. Here's a comparison of what I suggest vs a traditional lineup:

I assume you're using MVP potential players. A regular Center would have something like 17/17/17/8, with around 7 in the guard skills for a salary of 183k at his cap. If you switch OD and ID (17/9), you only have 70k salary and a free 20% towards the potential cap, or a PAS potential instead of MVP. Since this guy will be defending on the perimeter, he actually doesn't need 17 rebounding, but we'll leave it at that in order to get a little lower on the PG since he'll be a bit more expensive.

Then you'll have the PG, a MVP potential one for LI would have something like 14/12/17/15/15/16 with around 7 in the big skills (or 11 IS and 9 ID) for 131k. Switch up ID and OD (9/17) and you'll have a 74k guard at almost 20% cap left. Now when this guy is defending the key, he'll need more than 7 RB but if you make it 16 RB you'll still only be at 111k and within the cap. Now with the extra RB you'll need some more training, or you could choose to not make it as high because you already have high RB on your bigs. Say you'll put it at 14, and you'll be at 90k.

If you switch up these 2 players you'll save 150k salary (almost half what you'd have otherwise) while keeping the same overall skills (higher overall rebounding but a bit lower on the bigs, I'm guessing it kinda evens out).

Training schedule for 4 players:
Start with 3 seasons Pressure and Inside scoring for your bigs.
Then add your PG and do 1,5 season Rebounding, 0,5 season 1v1 and 1 season Passing.
Your C is ready (age 24), replace him with an SG and do 1,5 season Jumpshot.
Your PF is ready (age 24,5), continue training Inside defense for 1,5 season.
Train 1 season passing and 1 season Outside shooting to finish your PG.
Train Rebounding, 1v1 and some Ball handling to finish your SG.

By the time your bigs and PG are ready, they are 28 and 25. I think that's viable. You could also choose to short the cyle a bit and only train Centers and PG, but you'll save less salary.

EDIT:
You can also buy a semi-trained SF that has something like 13/10/7/9/10/7/8/10/12/8 at 22 or something and train him together with your bigs at the start. I don't know if this saves money, but you have a spare training slot at the start and you could use it like this.


Last edited by Jeründerbar at 2/11/2013 11:28:01 AM