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I do remember.

Actually i still think it's more difficult to play push the ball with succeed than playing with other tactics like R&G or LI. Push the ball needs certain skills in the line-up that makes it so complicated to play it while to play R&G with 3 outside players you can perform well or the same goes with LI with 2 centers and 1 good PG you still can play nice focussing on inside.


As a coach it's more important to take good tactical decisions than the players you have or the players you are willing to have, it's more about to make that players perform well than to have perfect players.

Secondary trainings don't require an increase in salary and are not capped so hard by potential,so if you stop the primary training before players hit the cap,they can train secondaries skills for a very long time

It sounds strange for me. Has anyone similar experience as Steve? I thought that once the player is capped all trainings are much slower (and many secondary training are very slow even before the cap due to low or high height).

The potential cap is based on skills sum,but obviously the skills has a different weight for different roles.5 level in Js for a player listed as C has a different impact of 5 level in JS for a player listed as G..The salary formula should indicate the skills that have an higher impact on skills sum for reaching the potential cap,so if you stop training before you hit the cap for a role,the increase in secondary skills has a minimal to zero impact on potential cap.
So,if a player is not totally capped,and players with 9(high decimals)-10-11 potential often not reach the cap for salary problems,you can train him in secondaries virtually till the end of his BB life

I believe that small communities should focus on primaries (Chile, Iran, Switzerland), large communities can afford to focus more on secondaries (France, Spain).

It's not a way for me. And I have two reasons:
1) it's hard to find in our country team which is ready to buy (and train) czech player with salary 150k-200k, our community is very salary sensitive
2) I'm not ready to keep myself players which don't deserve his salary and I'm ready to take care of 3 czech players as soon as I win B3

The skillsum of Player A with HA/DR at 5 is lower by 20 than the skillsum of Player B with HA/DR at 15; but if Player B has 5 primary skill levels more than A, he will be stronger.

I'm not sure about that, it depends on tactic and distribution of primary and also secondary skills. I'm not sure if you talked about inside, outside or all players with example of HA/DR. But secondaries are not just about HA/DR.

Actually i still think it's more difficult to play push the ball with succeed than playing with other tactics like R&G or LI. Push the ball needs certain skills in the line-up that makes it so complicated to play it while to play R&G with 3 outside players you can perform well or the same goes with LI with 2 centers and 1 good PG you still can play nice focussing on inside.

And just about that, almost all our players due to skillset fit to Push the Ball. But just few of them fits also for R&G, LI or some other tactics. So we at moment we are ready to play different tactics just if all players for specific tactic are in very good GS. But we will have more and more players for different tactics and then will come their time.

And part of my philosophy is not to be dependent on opponent tactic. So it means be able to set lineup and tactic which wins the game whatever opponent plays.

The skillsum of Player A with HA/DR at 5 is lower by 20 than the skillsum of Player B with HA/DR at 15; but if Player B has 5 primary skill levels more than A, he will be stronger.

I'm not sure about that, it depends on tactic and distribution of primary and also secondary skills. I'm not sure if you talked about inside, outside or all players with example of HA/DR. But secondaries are not just about HA/DR.

I agre with Czech coach here.It's not so easy to say a thing like that,the difference you talk about is enormous in secondaries skills,and also a big man with high DR/HA is much more effective
It depend on the level of the primaries and on the things you are searching in a player.Surely for a 150k big man I would prefer more primary skills,but on a player with higher primaries and salary better secondaries can help to handle better his maintenance in a team,that is an important thing for NT coaches

Last edited by Steve Karenn at 2/22/2011 9:28:34 AM

So I understand your message firstly in different way (incorrectly).
But I still see one very important difference which affects club which own such a players.
First one with training primaries as much as possible before switching to secondaries will have to pay very high salary for many season and will have even play this player with that huge wage off position.
Second one will pay many seasons reasonable salary by training secondaries earlier and the wage will increase later by training primaries.

My defence tactic was 3-2 zone but I played MtM..

It happened also in Estonia-Nederland game where Nederland ordered man to man D but played 32! I believe that's why they won after 2 ET's:( With man to man we would've finished the game earlier to our favor. This case should be studied further!

I believe that small communities should focus on primaries (Chile, Iran, Switzerland), large communities can afford to focus more on secondaries (France, Spain).

I believe everybody should focus on an intermediate position where you do need to have top level primary skills(right now that is a C of 250k) if you want to go for a good result in WC, and trying to maximize the secondary skills of their most talented players(given by talent at draft and potential) wich are likely to be ones who will play in your NT until they are 33-34.

I fairly think a lot of people would agree with this, the main issue here is how to engage people into NT training and how to create a scheme of tactical work where you can have consistent good results(not a perfect score, but consistent victories).

Because in the end, every country has the same amount of players to fill in a first and second div wich is were a NT player can be competitive for their team. Big countries might have more chances to create farm teams but you can't keep a 450k on a farm because that farm should play at least in second div and this is very unlikley to happen for periods higher than a season.

So I honestly think the main differences would not be players(in wich at anypoint the most likely training strategy to be dominant will be copied for others NT) but the degree of organization for every community and the quality of the tactical team behind NT decisions.

Last edited by Zero, the Magi. at 2/22/2011 9:43:16 AM

Your approach stands out and deserves the attention it gets. That is why we others always try to find weaknesses in it ;-)

Maybe this is main point. The others are worried it sometimes starts work. But no chance to unsettle me. Only poor participation of our community can persuade me to give it up. Or someone can beat me in elections if community starts to be impatient that it take so much time to make some achievements. But I hope at the moment my position is still quite strong.

So I understand your message firstly in different way (incorrectly).
But I still see one very important difference which affects club which own such a players.
First one with training primaries as much as possible before switching to secondaries will have to pay very high salary for many season and will have even play this player with that huge wage off position.
Second one will pay many seasons reasonable salary by training secondaries earlier and the wage will increase later by training primaries.

Basically the only skills that you can't train at least a minimum in position are JR,OD and PAS for big mans and REB and SB for guards(Sf needs all,so they have to change their training position)
You have good arguments,but I think that you can't be so radical.I think that instead of training only in a direction(secondary to primari and primary to secondary) the best thing would be to train secondaries in position while the player is still young to avoid the side effects on salary/potential/lack of competitivity

Instead of training intensively IS,for example,you would better train JS for SF-PF when a player still is far from coming in the NT,so you would increase both a primary(IS) and a secondary skill(JS) at the same time,while having less impact on salary and potential than a monorole IS,,so when he need to improve in his primary skills as laststep to enter in NT,he will yet have great secondaries skills

You need to train out of position only in specific situations,as like OD to have a great PF


Last edited by Steve Karenn at 2/22/2011 9:45:25 AM

I believe that small communities should focus on primaries (Chile, Iran, Switzerland), large communities can afford to focus more on secondaries (France, Spain).

I believe everybody should focus on an intermediate position where you do need to have top level primary skills(right now that is a C of 250k) if you want to go for a good result in WC, and trying to maximize the secondary skills of their most talented players(given by talent at draft and potential) wich are likely to be ones who will play in your NT until they are 33-34.

I fairly think a lot of people would agree with this, the main issue here is how to engage people into NT training and how to create a scheme of tactical work where you can have consistent good results(not a perfect score, but consistent victories).

Because in the end, every country has the same amount of players to fill in a first and second div wich is were a NT player can be competitive for their team. Big countries might have more chances to create farm teams but you can't keep a 450k on a farm because that farm should play at least in second div and this is very unlikley to happen for periods higher than a season.

So I honestly think the main differences would not be players(in wich at anypoint the most likely training strategy to be dominant will be copied for others NT) but the degree of organization for every community and the quality of the tactical team behind NT decisions.

I completely agree with your reasoning :D