BuzzerBeater Forums

What advancement? D5 to D4? Just kidding but not too much

Exactly how much is "massive amount of money"? I like numbers. Japanese revealed some numbers. You should too.

Touche. Descriptive words like massive are always relative. I've made good money training and selling; it's all in my transfer history, no reason to post it on the forums.

To be honest, I didn't see anything arrogant in his previous posts.

Did you miss all this?

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

I hsould be nicer to you, back when I was daytrading regularly, guys like you were my customers.

...this is coming from one of the most successfull trainers of the last couple seasons.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHA

You are clueless, completely clueless.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHA

If I come across as arrogant so be it, but I don't even come close to comments like these. If Wolph wants to lament the state of this game, the worthlessness of training and JR, the awesome art of daytrading, etc. he should be doing it in a different forum.

When posters ask for training help, they don't need some crackpot telling them training is worthless, nor do they need to read a bunch of HAHAHAHAHAHAHAs and LOLs

Dude, I thought you were the one whining about people condescending to you?


I'll throw my 2 cents in here, just cause I can't help myself.

I'm actually somewhat sympathetic to Wolph's argument. In the end, I kinda feel that if you define success solely by wins and losses and league advancement, probably it is a bit faster to do day trading and buy all veterans, while not training people. One reason is that obviously you can turn your players over more quickly, so that let's you more quickly change players as learn from your mistakes. It takes some time to get a better feeling for what skills are important and how to truly evaluate players.

The issue with training is that there's a longer delay from initially starting out and then really figuring out who is a decent player to start with, and what skills train quickly versus slowly, and how many pops to expect per season, etc. That can lead you to spend a decent chunk of time training non-ideal guys, before you learn that they weren't the best people to train. That training will still have some worth, and you are adding value, but you can be missing out on "player overall worth" compared to starting with better initial trainees (opportunity cost and all that).

However, I think it's pretty obvious that the training at lower levels IS possible, and valuable, contrary to Wolph's absolutist assertions. And given all the arguments and comparison of team's using the different approaches, I don't see any compelling argument for one leading to a faster advancement than another. It's not like daytrading and all veteran-no training approach is required to advance, so then it's really up to the user to decide what's more fun.

This must be a cultural thing because I have no issue with you but find it funny that you are so aggressive and leap to the assumption that this is part of some Machevelian plan to spread lies and mistruths to raise the price for some player that I intend to sell in the future. This assumption is a little odd, but I still like you and your many crusades.

Back to the actual discussion.

I am sure you will agree that after the draft you can easily pick up 19 year old all stars with ok primaries and salaries of $4-5,000 for 25k or less. Surely I don't have to show you.

Agree?

Next I am sure we agree that even with a level 4 trainer that 19 year old if trained single position (I never said double, that would be silly) for 4-5 seasons could get to the triple sensational I described. Easily! I even allowed to age 25! Even though I am ""a fool"". Why do I have to show you an example? As you said I am "completly clueless" but I can (barely) do the maths. Average in the 3 skills to sensational is a total of 18 pops over 4-5 seasons. How can you possibly dispute this?

Agree?

So we have established you can make the $25,000 or less cost rookie into the triple sensational guy easily and now I don't have to show you, show you, show you? Do I?

Back to the TL.

Can't see the guy you listed, any age, any potential, PRODIGIOUS OD for sale on the 24th for $100,000, but there is one on the 26th, but there is three days left, he will go for way more than a million and he has bad passing so misses under all measures. I jacked the sale price up to $1,000,000 to try and find the guy you were talking about but all I can see is guys with way less than sensational JS and PA (and the only player that is close is 31 not 25 or less).

I know you are joking when you say

I'm not sure what age matters when we are talking about CAPPED players.

you just forgot to add the smiley at the end. You are not trying to tell me that a capped 21 year old is worth the same as a capped 35 year old with identical skills. I know you are kidding. Here is what you forgot to add ->

:P

Finally, I will look for your 13+ OD under 150k...plenty.

Actually there is nine. How many also have sensational passing? None. None of the auctions even finish in the next 23 hours, funny that. They are just guys who have been listed low, not sold low. Several of those guys (who are not as good as the examples I gave) have TPEs and guess what, all but one are around a million and the one who doesn't is exactly the sort of guy you hate a JS monster, as well as being really old. He is the only one who will come close so I have bookmarked him and we shall see tomorrow his actual sale price.

Good advice, Gunner. I would make one suggestion. If you're going to get some decent trainees, regardless of div (lower level included), why purchase them with a potential anything lower than p.allstar. I'm sure you're aware that a trainee needs to have this as minimum, and I'm also sure you said 'star' as he is in a low division with limited cash. However, if we're serious in helping him learn this game then we need to give him the facts: he needs to do everything suggested by others (in terms of firing the trainer and getting quality cheap older players) however, he also needs to invest in "good quality" trainees. As we know, this requires a minimum of p.allstar potential if he is going to train them up successfully. Yes, I can also appreciate that he will likely make mistakes in his training being a newby and this is why you may have also suggested the "star" potential, but again (and I'm not being smart here at all), let's give him the best info we can and let him do with it what he may. :-)

I am a big fan of superstar potential myself. However for new players they can't afford them. We will have to agree to disagree about the costs of getting those allstars but don't forget I am talking about 19 year olds after the draft. They are literally given away. The player I wanted to draft myself was a 6'0" $4,000 superstar potential 19 year old who was picked one place ahead of me and sold for $3,000. Everyone wants 18, but as a new player at that time you can get some incredible bargains on 19 year olds.

Right now I am training two superstar potential guys (and an all-star) with a level 6 trainer, but new teams just can't afford the players or the trainer. I think we agree about what is the best thing to do.