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You got me all wrong,i agree i might have written hard words that were not in place but i DO think that if ID and OD and RB affact the game a lot more then SB then it should be mentioned in the rules.

And i want to add that i see a lot of offers for changes and i never seen any being accepted except the stuff system that was needed a lot and was changed.

Sorry if i angered anyone that gave his time for improving this game but also keep in mind i'm doing it also from my house and my keybored as much as i can and just becouse i LOVE this game and want the game exp to improve.

Last edited by Doctor J at 1/14/2009 5:23:29 PM

I have rarely seen a post on BuzzerBeater that is that long and so completely incorrect from first to last.

I would say in the last he is finally right:

SB it's a usless skill and nothing more if a colossal SB player do 1 block in 53 min and a respectable SB player in the same game did 3 blocks in 43 min an another respectable SB player also did 3 blocks in 47 min all in the same game...and for the end that colossal SB player NEVER did most of the blocks in any game he played for crying out loud!

Me and some friend of mine have look, often for high shotblocking players and they mostly suck in Shot Blocked ... You won't see significant differences to a SB 6 or 7 guy, especially if this one play on guard who seem to make more blocks then big guys.

Because of this correaltion, we expect shot block affect the game in another way, as a part of Inside defence. So we went wrong, that wasn't fine but could happen :( But when shotblocking don't contribute to the game, there is something wrong because it contributes to the salary of the center in an significant way and like Forrest said before, they won't make players become bad in training then because you can't untrain then.

I have rarely seen a post on BuzzerBeater that is that long and so completely incorrect from first to last.

I would say in the last he is finally right:

SB it's a usless skill and nothing more if a colossal SB player do 1 block in 53 min and a respectable SB player in the same game did 3 blocks in 43 min an another respectable SB player also did 3 blocks in 47 min all in the same game...and for the end that colossal SB player NEVER did most of the blocks in any game he played for crying out loud!

Me and some friend of mine have look, often for high shotblocking players and they mostly suck in Shot Blocked ... You won't see significant differences to a SB 6 or 7 guy, especially if this one play on guard who seem to make more blocks then big guys.

Because of this correaltion, we expect shot block affect the game in another way, as a part of Inside defence. So we went wrong, that wasn't fine but could happen But when shotblocking don't contribute to the game, there is something wrong because it contributes to the salary of the center in an significant way and like Forrest said before, they won't make players become bad in training then because you can't untrain then.

A superior shot blocker in the NBA will block anywhere from 2 to 3 shots a game. Without doing any extensive research, I'd hazard the guess that this rate is pretty much par for shot blockers in BB as well.

By the way this thread is going, I am left with the impression that people expect players to come out and block 5 shots a game with regularity, which is not going to happen.

You may think that 5-6 obligatory misses in the game are not a big deal. However, I guarantee you these may be the difference in a close game.

If anything is a problem, it's the fact that guards are able to block a disproportionate amount of shots -- despite the fact that the rules say SB is not very useful for perimeter players.

The fact that guards are blocking is not a problem...it happens in real life,the fact that SB skill level is not shown as a factor in SB made in a game is very disterbing.

If one player is level 16 in SB and another is 3 there shouled be a major diffrence...the problem is that there isn't...by trying to be realistic in the number of blocks per game(3 is high)you are "killing" the SB importence,in the current situation in should be as a part of ID and surely not stand as a skill by itself,it's misleading to think it's importent as the other skills which is not,the SB in the game have some factors that SB is a part of but other skills are more major and affective like ID and OD.

Thats the probelm and we have more then 75 massages about that...maybe when they cross the 100 somebody will realise there IS a probelm with the current situation.

Does anyone know what the proportion of types of shots that are taken in BB are? are guards just taking too many shots in BB and that's why shot blocking is higher amongst gaurds? or are the distributions of the kinds of shots correct and guards are blocking too many of them.

I guess naively I would suspect more guards to be gaurding outside shots/long range jump shots, and centers to be gaurding inside shots/dunk shots, and so what the distribution of blocks should be should be a function of whether there are more inside versus outside shots.

A superior shot blocker in the NBA will block anywhere from 2 to 3 shots a game. Without doing any extensive research, I'd hazard the guess that this rate is pretty much par for shot blockers in BB as well.

By the way this thread is going, I am left with the impression that people expect players to come out and block 5 shots a game with regularity, which is not going to happen.

You may think that 5-6 obligatory misses in the game are not a big deal. However, I guarantee you these may be the difference in a close game.

This just isn't true. For one, are there any players blocking 2-3 shots per game?

On my team, my PG and C both play about 30 minutes. My 6' 1" PG with awful (3) Shot Blocking has 0.9 bpg. My 6' 9" U-21 USA Center with prominent (10) Shot blocking has 0.5 bpg.

Can you show such example were players with decent to good shot blocking are really blocking 2-3 shots per game?

BB's need to give life to the Manute Bol's and Mark Eaton's! Let them live!


Steve
Bruins




Last edited by Solana_Steve at 1/14/2009 8:49:56 PM

This just isn't true. For one, are there any players blocking 2-3 shots per game?

Which, in particular, isn't true? If BB is anything like the NBA, they should be few and far between.

Can you show such example were players with decent to good shot blocking are really blocking 2-3 shots per game?

There are only 4 players in the entire NBA averaging 2-3 blocked shots per game, how many do you think there will be in BB?

My PF/C with strong shot blocking swats 1.5 shots in just 25 minutes per game.

To put this number in perspective, as of tonight there are only 21 players doing better, and just 4 of them play 25 minutes or less. This sums up to less than 1 player per team.

Along the same lines, how much shot blocking do you think a center needs to average 3 block a game? I'd say proficient is not enough, especially in top leagues -- just the same way proficient inside scoring or inside defense is not sufficient.

Just for reference: http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/stats/bycategory?cat=Fielding...

Sure, from a statical standpoint the total number of shots blocked is probably only slightly lower than in the NBA. My team blocks about 5 shots a game and the average NBA teams seems to block about 4 to 6+ shots per game.

The real problem is the distribution. There is very little correlation between the shot blocking skill and the number of blocks. If somebody with no skill in shot blocking is blocking at 0.5 - 1.0 bpg -- those with the skill are blocking only a fraction higher -- then the skill is practical worthless.

If you look at the leaders from the NBA, you'd see they're all big men. Look here...Wade is the only guard in the whole NBA with an average greater than 0.4 bpg: http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/stats/byposition?pos=G&co...

In Buzzerbeater terms, if you've got lousy SB skill, you should almost never block a shot. If you have decent shot blocking skills, your average is about right. If you have good SB skills, your average should probably double.

Now here's the kicker...here's how shot blocking can become a more equal skill. In real basketball, shot blockers don't just block 2-3 shots per game. They force probably twice as may shots to be altered from guards driving into the paint or against post players.


Steve
Bruins

By the way this thread is going, I am left with the impression that people expect players to come out and block 5 shots a game with regularity, which is not going to happen.

no a bad shoot blocker will give his opponent easy oppurtunitys to score because he jump up to a fake, a good shot blocker will affect many shoots he doesn't block because the people have to throw above his hand and this will lead to more missed shot ... That what i expect ;)

In real i saw a lot of player who try to block everythink and give the opponent so much free point, to get a solid block stats - so that good blocking don't correlate much with the amount of blocks. because good shot blocking laso means, to know when to block ...

And if one block is average genious for a player, and no affected shots, you won't pay then money for it kozlo.

The real problem is the distribution. There is very little correlation between the shot blocking skill and the number of blocks. If somebody with no skill in shot blocking is blocking at 0.5 - 1.0 bpg -- those with the skill are blocking only a fraction higher -- then the skill is practical worthless.

I agree that distribution is a problem. I said this a couple of posts up.

I don't think this necessarily makes the skill worthless for centers, since shot blocking on guards doesn't help you as much when the opponent is playing an inside tactic.

Guards make more blocks then center with smaller skill, so why it isn't helping you?

Even with inside tactic i expect an nealry similiar amount of blcoked shots.